Ian's Journal

Ian: So now I can sense my self as a being, sometimes being a son, or being an employee, as in those ways of being occasionally come to the fore and my mood changes and i start thinking and imagining in the way of that being, and recognise that I am being this or that and decide to not go down those roads and come back to enjoying and appreciating instead… increasingly easily… so where in the past i may have been responding or reacting as a son, maybe a frustrated son or a worried son, and wanting to be a good son or a different kind of son, now I can more easily stop being a son and instead I carry on enjoying the moment as it is… this is a different way of being… not sure if it aligns with the in control different way of being but different than normal, right angles different. Ian's Journal - #40 by Ian

Hi Ian,

This is such an enjoyable description. Now you are beginning to discover aspects of your social identity – a son, an employee and possibly others. And naïvely paying attention to the attributes of these aspects of identity you have the choice to decline those aspects and eventually allow them to wither so that you not only can continue to enjoy and appreciate being here but naïvely marvel in wide-eyed wonder at the magnificence of the physical world around you.

This is still the same way of being even though much more enjoyable than before with less moods and triggers to diminish your enjoyment. As I wrote here a few weeks ago –

It is so much fun to discover and allow naiveté, to be like a child again (with adult sensibilities) and to more be like what you are rather than what (internalized) other people want you to be. I have it on good authority that remembering to be naive can/will boost your baseline of feeling good to feeling excellent. It’s the opposite of stressing, telling yourself off or pushing hard – it’s being playful, liking yourself and others and enjoying and appreciation being here without any cause or condition, just enjoying being alive.

Have a look at Richard’s description where this being naive can lead to – A Quaint Clay-Pit Tale.

Cheers Vineeto

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Thankyou Vineeto :slight_smile:

I am certainly having more fun now, even if I’m not doing anything in particular it’s still fun, especially compared to how I used to be…as recently as a week ago…

When I read thay clay pit tale now I know I’m in beginning to be in touch with that, in that the glimpses and moments where I know what he is describing are at my fingertips…the magical world I am so close to, as with reading the reports of becoming free, it is thrilling and encouraging!

This is perfect thank you :blush:

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And it really is so much fun. It feels like have crossed a threshold where now I am engaged in the play of increasing my enjoyment and appreciation, becoming happy and harmless, above/instead of my normal goals, because it is so much fun - fun now, to see the way I tick, to identify/describe the different facets/faces of being this identity, and gently let them slide in favour of more harmlessness.

There’s so much to it, so much wonderfulness - it seems every part of the experience of being alive is fascinating.

I’m having what seems to be somewhat cyclical (as my energy and attention waxes and wanes) waves of experiences of naivete that I haven’t had before, where there is no enemy, where life is playful and joyful, where shimmers of amazement and wonder come to the fore, where there is literal pleasure trickling through my body in just being alive - sensuosity is also of the internal body, where feeling good really feels so good, where appreciation of my fellow human being (great phrase) and the acknowledgement of effort made and energy imparted by us as individuals and collectively comes easily.

Enjoying seeing where this is going.

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Right now I feel like theres nothing left to do but enjoy this moment, like I’ve won the battle, the thought is I’ve made it! and now can enjoy my last wee while as a decaying parasite. The end of the road is coming and I’m happy about it.

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Good day Ian,

I don’t know if you heard, there is a serious mental health warning regarding a new, very contagious virus called “naiveté”.

It is highly contagious because it has been discovered that it spreads on the psychic network via happy and harmless vibes such as is happening already on this forum and is therefore not restricted to only local outbreaks of the disease. It is something entirely new in the real world. Even though children display certain symptoms when young, they soon grow out of it. But now formerly serious grown-ups and easily manageable obedient citizens have been afflicted, and increasingly it appears that it can pop up anywhere on the planet.

Because it spreads via the psychic network it cannot be contained via the trusted methods of isolation, hence clinical virologists are at a loss how to deal with it. They know from some known cases that if unchecked it will, in its final stage, lead to insanity, namely depersonalisation, derealisation, alexithymia and anhedonia. Authorities can only suggest intensifying seriousness and activating resentment and cynicism as a precaution. Some suggested to use the deterrent of labelling those already afflicted as followers of a cult but that has proven ineffective because of the large cultural-background variety of those afflicted.

The symptoms which have been reported (from one afflicted person) are as follows –

And it really is so much fun. It feels like have crossed a threshold where now I am engaged in the play of increasing my enjoyment and appreciation, becoming happy and harmless, above/instead of my normal goals, because it is so much fun – fun now, to see the way I tick, to identify/describe the different facets/faces of being this identity, and gently let them slide in favour of more harmlessness.
There’s so much to it, so much wonderfulness – it seems every part of the experience of being alive is fascinating.
I’m having what seems to be somewhat cyclical (as my energy and attention waxes and wanes) waves of experiences of naivete that I haven’t had before, where there is no enemy, where life is playful and joyful, where shimmers of amazement and wonder come to the fore, where there is literal pleasure trickling through my body in just being alive – sensuosity is also of the internal body, where feeling good really feels so good, where appreciation of my fellow human being (great phrase) and the acknowledgement of effort made and energy imparted by us as individuals and collectively comes easily. (link)

Further symptoms have been observed elsewhere –

There was a sensation in my head of unending delight. I was here again. There was immediacy and there was so much in this moment that I could not ask for anything more. Complete abundance the likes of which I had not experienced before. What surprised me even more was that for a few moments, I could not go back. It was happening on its own. This unending delight. (link)

I found myself to be like a kid again for a brief moment. And in that being-like-a-kid revivification, it occurred to me with a crystal-clear clarity and obviousness as to how I do not have to be/feel the way blind nature dictated that I feel … (link)

And today while experimenting with this “fresh” information it became clear to me how appreciation, i.e. being a person who appreciates whatever is happening to him, is tightly connected to being naive because I could not bring myself to be like this without feeling a bit foolish, a real simpleton! (link)

As long as I’m liking myself (even to the point of experiencing such unending delight), it is delicious to naturally extend that enjoyment and appreciation to incorporate any and all people. […] … there’s an immense safety in this way of being (as in, I can never be hurt). It requires no morality […], as it is sensible, delightful and effortless. […] Life is much simpler from the vantage point of being naive (being likeable and liking). A lot of things can happen more spontaneously. Life is much less serious. (Private conversation, 24.9.2024)

And I realized – I could be sensuous! I can use the energy for sensuousness, instead. And so I proceeded to naively be sensuous and I saw that I could always be sensuous, because actuality is already always happening anyway – so sensuousness is always possible to be an ‘activity’ that one does, so to speak.
And the benefit was immediately tangible – everything shone into perfect clarity and richness, and it was immensely wondrous and enjoyable to boot! (link)

One is seen to be odd in no longer having a ‘grand plan’ of any description, in going blank when asked ‘who are you’ or ‘what is next’, and yet it is the denizens of the ‘real world’ that are always quick to complain about life being a burden. So all in all I am gladly proceeding towards insanity, haha. (link)

‘Worldly-wise scientists’ who have seen such reports are deeply concerned – the development of the viral disease seems to start with not being serious and having too much fun, and then disregarding some of the pillars of the strict morality of this generally sedate and obedient population. So far, they have detected no physical danger to other people as those afflicted appear good-natured, kind and gentle – but the disturbing and unsettling aspect is that they are happy and carefree, and such people cannot be controlled and/or manipulated back in line towards the status quo by arousing in them feelings of anger or fear.

Those afflicted also report experiencing a “pure intent” to leave this real world for good. If this uncontrollable disease spreads around the globe, authorities fear, it will be the end of wars and stress and the world as we know it, and therefore thousands of people employed in those industries will be out of a job.

Here is how one man who caught the virus early in his life and who was diagnoses with the above psychiatric classifications by accredited psychiatrists even said that not being afflicted with the virus of naiveté and its ramifications was “foolishness of the highest order”

To the realist – the ‘worldly-wise’ – this appears like utter foolishness. After all, life is a ‘vale of tears’ and one must ‘make the best of a bad situation’ because one ‘can’t change human nature’; and therefore ‘you have to fight for your rights’. This derogatory advice is endlessly forthcoming; the put-down of the universe goes on ad nauseam, wherever one travels throughout the world. This universe is so enormous in size – infinity being as enormous as it can get – and so magnificent in its scope – eternity being as magnificent as it can get – how on earth could anyone believe for a minute that it is all here for humans to be forever miserable and malicious in?
It is foolishness of the highest order to believe it to be impossible to be free. (link)

End of warning message – your life will never be the same again.

Cheers Vineeto

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We’ve entered a new era of Actual Freedom content.

If anyone here is afflicted by this, I’d recommend you maintain your composure as the authorities are out there looking for people having a good time. The thought-police are ever vigilant.

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We’re going to have to lay low. That means no centralized location, no recognized leaders, no identifying garments, no shared culture. You’ll be blending in with the denizens of the real world. With any luck, you’ll rub off on them.

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Scientists have started calling it the “Green Pant Yellow Shirt” disease because sources say that’s where it all started

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Oh dear … this sounds serious…:rofl:

Amazing really, this is so wonderful and marvelous…the ultimate collaboration.

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Experiencing a change in dynamic when interacting with others from caring about their wellbeing as entities to caring about them becoming free…just a taster a few times today, quite a shift in perspective…the focus falls again on me becoming free rather than being empathetic or understanding of their personal turmoils, beliefs, experiences…which to a large extent my skill in that area is founded in wanting to feel safe…ie. if someone feels understood then they are less threatened/threatening…but then all that happens is they feel that I feel the same that life is suffering, and we suffer together which, although there is momentary relief provided…it is a trap of mutual validation.

A bonus of seeing this was feeling free of the gravity of the social interaction. I was free to not participate in the passionate discussion that was going on, without the usually accompanying anxiety, guilt, confusion.

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My experience has been that ‘feeling understood’ is code for ‘you agree with me’

As long as there’s not agreement, it’s like “oh if only I explain this other facet of my worldview, they’ll see it my way”… from within a worldview, everything seems to make sense.

I’ve seen it from both sides!

Richard’s approach was to ask a lot of questions to understand where someone was coming from, and then use that to be able to probe with hopes of drawing out the actual person. He didn’t often have success but it’s worth the effort, and of course he describes it as being great fun :smile:

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And code for ‘you agree with me’ is ‘you are with me’ and of course the flip side which can become readily apparent is ‘you are against me’. So then it is easily seen why that game inevitably leads not only to further unhappiness but also conflict, meanwhile intimacy and equity is nowhere to be found.

I was just wondering now what kind of intimacy can ‘I’ have. After all ‘I’ cannot have actual intimacy and yet ‘I’ do not have to settle for emotional intimacy. What ‘I’ can have is a naive intimacy :grin:

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OK thanks @henryyyyyyyyyy @Kub933 precisely - so following on with that I think that now I’m getting the harmlessness thing - recognising I care about myself becoming free also; I want the best for myself too. And the best I can do for the other is to stop getting in the way with my ‘emotional needs’, my ‘way’… I declined to have emotional needs this morning and it was easy because I could see it wasn’t the best to continue to have them and have them either met or unmet. My need to be understood and empathised with is funnily enough :slight_smile: the same thing as for everyone else.

So wanting the best - meaning the experience of the actual world for all - means that I no longer want to be in the way of that, which means choosing to be harmless.

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A cool feature of any change is that anything of me that goes, goes; it doesn’t take any effort to maintain…if it requires maintenance there’s just more to do first

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Ok so loving the I am the herd thing…starting to click now how I feel certain ways in order to keep me in the herd, keeping me suffering, keeping everything going…like guilt which was mentioned earlier on the forum…also fear, also love, loneliness maybe? Must be…

all of them really

Anyway with this perspective now it’s more obvious what is happening and there’s less power in feeling that way…depowered

Digging up some more plants, some digging from this side, some digging from that side, some roots are easy some appear bigger and deeper…

Digging myself out of the ground hahha

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Today I find myself wondering what it must actually be like to be like @Vineeto when interacting with all us normies… obviously I can’t know, but the wondering puts me in an even more alert frame of mind to be attentive to the smallest changes in mood, in order to treat those I meet as fellow human beings, as fellow travellers…wanting the best for them.

A feeling that arises is a loneliness when it is obvious that the person I’m speaking to doesn’t have the same awareness, intention, desire, value …so it seems I am looking for someone to come with me on this journey; another objection dragging the anchor in the sand

Just recognising this now

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Hi Ian

There was so much useful information in your seemingly simple and naïve post that I had to dissect it to make sure I can follow it ( and not get confused ), and I came up with the following :

Ian
24d
Rad, so much to digest!

I think I am making progress into —— how to feel out beliefs now.

Emotion backed thought; —— The idea (1 ) + the feeling dimension.(2 )

Like the belief ( 1 ) in hierarchy - all the reified notions ( 1 ) of rank, higher and lower, power and subservience, as a concept … + … the literal feeling ( 2 ) of being higher or lower or somewhere in the middle, or withdrawing or exerting, elements of fear, glee, compassion.
Maybe I can see it more clearly because I don’t feel the resentment I would normally feel from being under the power of another.

And there is a felt anchoring point ( 2 ) , where the **belief ( 2 )**is tied together to form an aspect of me, like a line of code — that interprets reality — and outputs feeling driven behaviour ( 3 ).

Part of the illusion ( 4 ) — is the feeling ( 2 ) that there is a tie or anchor ( 1 aka belief, personal and societal ) or root or a binding structure that keeps it there. That’s the mark of good training, that it holds in place. Frightened and beholden to another.

But as with the resentment, I am just holding on to being that feeling, I was going to say initial feeling, but it is actually the current feeling. And the deep sigh of relief as is let go, amazing that to become free of these things, wonderful wonderful wonderful. That’s what freedom is. No longer bound.

Being that feeling. As in a feeling being. I am being that feeling and that is what shapes me into the particular feeling being that I am. Wowwww :smiley:

Delight to read your posts along with others like Kub Cluadiu Vineeto and others .
:appreciation:

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To the list of # ( 1 )s objections can be added, as was mentioned by Ian ( having been pointed out by Vineeto to him ).

( 1 ) Beliefs Notions “Certainty” Bias( conscious or unconscious ), etc… form Objections !

Hi Ian,

As today’s post follows your excellent post on “the herd thing” (link), it is understandable that you contemplate “what it must actually be like to be like Vineeto when interacting with all us normies”, identifying yourself as one of the ‘herd’. Whereas Vineeto, being actually free, only meets the actual flesh-and-blood bodies, when she interacts with people and as such there are no “smallest changes in mood” or “loneliness”. There is an actual intimacy operating, no matter if the “person I’m speaking to doesn’t have the same awareness, intention, desire, value” or not.

On the last day of Claudiu’s first visit to Richard and Vineeto in April 2012 he also wondered – but he wondered the opposite – “a deep existential probing.” He “became intensely curious to see the world Richard & Vineeto were actually living in”. This naïve wonder almost catapulted him into the actual world, he just stopped himself in the last minute, lol. You can read about it here.

When Peter was naïvely “wondering what it was like for Richard living in the actual world of people, things and events as distinct from living in a self-created illusionary bubble of one’s own making” with the result that he “became aware of a quite extraordinary sweetness – a sweetness that was palpable rather than feeling based” … and the rest is history. (link)

However, you wanting to share your journey of discovery towards an actual freedom, or aspects of it, with a fellow human being does not need to be an “objection” – it can also be an expression/ motivation to look for someone who you can develop/ allow a delicious naïve intimacy with. Here is a practical example from Grace’s scale of intimacy (link) –

  • Togetherness is the companionship of doing things together – be it shopping, cooking, having sex, whatever – and pertains to the willingness to be and act in concert with another.
  • A closeness is where the personal boundaries are expanded to include the other into one’s own space; this is a normal type of intimacy.
  • A sweetness is when closeness entrées a lovely delight at the proximity of the other (although it can veer off into affection, ardency, love, oneness).
  • A richness (aka an excellence experience) is where sweetness segues into a near-absence of agency via letting-go of control and one is the sex and sexuality (the beer and not the doer).
  • Magical sex is where sex and sexuality are happening of their own accord – neither beer nor doer extant – and pristine purity abounds (an immaculate perfection).

[Richard]: I also detailed how feeling-being ‘Grace’, who was exacting in evaluating ‘her’ differing ways of being a ‘self’, had gradations of scale in regards to intimacy (togetherness: → closeness: → sweetness: → richness: → magicality) – all of which correlated to the range of naïveness from being sincere to becoming naïve and all the way through being naïveté itself to an actual innocence – in the second and third paragraphs[1] following on from the above.

[1]What did not get included in those second and third paragraphs, regarding feeling-being ‘Grace’ and her rigorous gradations, was ‘her’ oft-repeated observation – regarding the onset of the third stage, on that range of naïveness, where ‘her’ gradation of ‘great’ related to sweetness – about a bifurcation manifesting where the instinctual tendency/ temptation was to veer off in the direction of love and its affectuous intimacy (due to a self-centric attractiveness towards feeling affectionate) as contrasted to a conscious choice being required so as to somehow have that sweetness then segue into a naïve intimacy via what ‘she’ described as ‘richness’ and graded as ‘excellent’. [emphases added]

At this juncture it is a good idea to apply specific attentiveness to the smallest changes in mood at the point of the “bifurcation” mentioned above to not “veer off in the direction of love and its affectuous intimacy” if possible, so as to save yourself and your intimate playmate the stark mood swings which inevitably happen when one falls for love’s trappings, which always promises but never delivers.

I wish you best of success.

Cheers Vineeto

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