It has taken me a long time to get to that point of stop moralising about things that undercurrent of assessing as right or wrong.
I would feel guilty when a woman flirted with me or asked me out, even though I am not following through with anything and not cheating. Like I have done something to put out a sense of it is ok to make a move on me. Then feel guilty I am not a good husband.
So much going on around sexuality, desirability and commitment.
My legs and arms are hairy too, will it just look ridiculous? I don’t know. Sometimes I have thought of doing it for charity, donate to the cancer fund and watch me get waxed and suffer.
The friend I mentioned who passed away tried to grow a beard and it just looked like a bunch of pubes on his face!!! So it could be worse!
First time I went uni, this attractive girl asked me out in a bookshop and I just totally froze and then when I spoke my voice came out sounding like this weird character from the Police Academy films, see this link for the reference. Bobcat Goldthwait - YouTube
She walked away too 
Well I am totally screwed then
That’s a big LOL 
. It is quite funny though because I have always got the sort of comments that I am attractive and yet I have rarely had girls approach me. The ones I have spoken to about this said that I can be quite intimidating to approach and others see me as just a player and so to be avoided. So personally I have very rarely been approached by women. I guess what I am trying to get at here is that there is this fantasy that ‘some guys have it easy’ and seeing it through this lens does not view the full picture clearly. There is just so much there than even as a good looking guy you are dealing with, that fantasy can never be fulfilled.
Actually to be honest that’s not 100% true I do get approached sometimes but they still want me to ‘play the game’ it is rarely smooth sailing.
Now I am curious at to how this is for @Sonyaxx being with somebody who will draw such attention.
I feel so threatened when my wife gets attention but like myself it is few and far between for such encounters. If I was with someone who got attention day in day out that would really bring up some messy aspects of my identity.
I think it would so useful to have a female angle on all this too but we don’t have many here, @Sonyaxx how do you see all this if you fancy reading the 30+ lengthy posts 
Hehe @son_of_bob you got there first
Will give it a read in a bit
Okay so personally my past exes could be deemed as not conventionally “attractive” so I guess this is my first time being with someone seen as conventionally “attractive”
I admit at the start I was a bit worried about having to compete with swarms of girls but it turned out not being that way and I kind of surprised myself with when it did happen and I found negative feelings coming up. Mostly jealousy and insecurity. Most of it has faded now but occasionally those feelings do come up. I think it also helped that Kuba doesn’t really engage in “playing the game”
I think I also didn’t feel too threatened by it because I do receive alot of attention through Instagram and walking down the street so maybe if I didn’t that might be a different story. I think it also helps that both of us do jobs that are quite out there in terms of receiving attention. Me with my podium dancing and recently nude live drawing jobs and Kuba with the same (not the podium dancing😂) I feel like We both get to experience what it’s like to have our partners receiving quite a bit of attention.
I know a lot of women who love hairy men! 
I’ve also just spent the whole day with my girlfriends chatting about sex and what girls worry about with sex is pretty interesting. Most of it stems around overthinking during sex, insecurities about performing or being hot enough. Also a lot about being a “good” girlfriend by being the girl that will always be down for sex but at the same time “innocent”. An experienced virgin essentially
We also spoke about the countless amount of very “attractive” women we know in relationships with less “attractive”men
I notice that a lot of women, including me in the past dating less “attractive” men due to fear of constantly having to compete or the attention their partner may get from other women. It’s the “safer” option
However, we also did speak about how less “attractive” men often are nicer or have better personalities seeing as they can’t entirely rely on looks, they have to be nicer people to interact with. I’m guessing this is similar with attractive women?
I’ll write more when I have more time
i cant believe this …50 posts in less than 24 hours !!! poor me with weak English …it takes me the whole day to read them … 
What I realised this statement is that even the non direct attention of a smile, winks and other cues also trigger me. It doesn’t have to be full on flirting, attempting to chat up or date her for example. I experience jealousy as more of an internal attack of being inadequate. It is like more fuel to the fire.
Your lives sounds so alien to mine
Yes, I found one in my wife. 
This is fascinating, a lot of cross over with men too. The ‘experienced virgin’ state I see as a necessary balance of this hypocritical treatment of women, if they enjoy sex and are promiscuous they are ‘slut shamed’ if they are too prudish they are then criticised for being ‘frigid/ no fun’.
I have seen a mixture of responses for this for attractive friends. Some like yourself not too much and others like unbelievable level. I have known people who felt differently about it too, some found it like an annoyance and others loved it and took full advantage of it.
Some people are both super charismatic and charming as well as good looking, stylish, wealthy and smart, got the whole package going on.
I think for me as well if I do see these things it also makes me feel almost smug I guess? Like I know I’m with an attractive man, and he’s with me. That’s another thing to look at for me. It also makes me feel good when people notice that he’s in a relationship with me. It adds a little ego boost
Although I do rarely see this, maybe I don’t notice
Some people win the genetic lottery, attractive enough to partner with another person who won the genetic lottery. This whole sense of self steps in and takes credit for it, feels like they did something, when really parameters outside of one’s control determined their degree of attractiveness. I mean there are subjective ways one can improve their appearance, change hairstyle, fashion, wax their terrible body hair etc. However, ultimately many variables are out of one’s control.
I have always been fascinated by the accounts of attractive people who got badly injured like burnt or when actors have worn fat suits for roles and seen what is it like to be treated differently.
On the attention front, even people just looking at my wife, no indication of whether that is in a positive/neutral/negative stance I still auto-interpret as some form of positive attention.
I would like to say I do notice that a lot of men are very lonely. Most women will receive a lot of attention and sexual advances in their lifetime, wanted and unwanted. As a fairly conventionally “attractive” young woman myself I have previously demonised men for a lot of unwanted sexual advances and attention. I didn’t realise that a lot of men were so lonely and lacked attention or intimacy from the opposite sex, whether they were attractive or not. I noticed that it can be so hard for men to have sex due to a lot of societal beliefs and pressures. Obviously both women and men want to have sex. Women can get sex significantly easier then men but they will still “play the game” due to fear of being labelled a “slut” I think a lot of women do actually want to have sex with men but there are a lot of issues that come with that. A lot of women will hold out to make sure that the guy “proves” himself as a caring guy who won’t fuck her over. I think it’s hard for a lot of women to have sex for sexes sake due to fears of labels, and fear of being used just for sex. I think a lot of women want caring and intimacy along with the sex. It’s funny because it’s the withholding of the sex which leads to men being so desperate for it that they also “play the game” for sex and put on a facade for women to sleep with them. It’s a whole messed up cycle
I agree. My sister would get a lot of attention. I think it has calmed down a bit more so now she has hit 40 but even some of my friends would try and see if I can help them get a shot with her, or request family pictures of her.
That is interesting, I like to do this thing of dismissing attractive women. Like not talk or interact with them, like prove I do not need to have to be pulled into the orbit of their attractiveness. Sort of tying into that exceptionalism, so exceptional I can not be influenced by an attractive woman.
Yes, it is true. It was the case for me in several patches. I am good at being a friendly person I am very comfortable in the friend zone even but not good at being intimate. Even with my wife it doesn’t come naturally.
Yes, I used to feel so envious about this. Sometimes as a guy it can feel like the birds of paradise where you have to this elaborate dance to try and woo the female and prove your worthiness and the woman might not even been that attractive but we have to do and prove so much more because the power of choice lies with them (not the case for more attractive men, they bypass this.) (video link of birds of paradise mating dance - Bird Of Paradise Courtship Spectacle | Planet Earth | BBC Earth - YouTube
I see this as the equivalent counter balancing force to what us men have to go through with the whole having to prove ourselves. It is not a smooth ride for either sex.
I have known a lot of guys who have wanted this too. And there are many stories where women have harshly rejected them based on some aspect of their appearance, performance etc during sex.
Yes, I always too autonomous to stoop to this. Like fuck you all then, I will be that 40 year old virgin then.
Agreed.
With my personal experiences around Sex, I was always able to get sex when I wanted with pretty much who I wanted and I did take advantage of that. I was basically known as the girl who was “sexually free” what was really happening was I was taking my value as a pretty girl with how many people I got attention from or sleep with. I was also recovering from sexual assault (when I was 13) which led me to have a very wierd relationship with sex. I went the opposite way you’d expect. I really threw myself into it and I was definitely not happy. I never really feared being labelled a “slut” cause I knew that was silly but what I was doing was definitely unhealthy. I wasn’t actually having sex for the sake of enjoying it and believed my only value as a person was for sex.
I’ve also struggled with over thinking during sex, getting distracted/dissociating and even saying no if I didn’t want to have sex. I used to always “push through” I was scared of being a disappointment or having the fear of them ignoring me saying no and continuing on anyways. I also had the belief that if I didn’t orgasm then the sex wasn’t good instead of realising there was nothing really wrong with the sex, it was me not being able to be there in the moment. Obviously there are certain activities within sex that I could orgasm from and some that I don’t. But eventually I realised that this belief of having to orgasm every time I have sex was also what led my to not enjoy it as much. As soon as I let go of that I was able to actually be in the moment and enjoy the sex instead of constantly looking forward to an orgasm.
I still catch my self getting distracted when having Sex. For example getting distracted by the lava lamp or the picture above the bed. But when Kuba and I have sex now a days it’s much lighter and fun for me without the pressure on myself to act or behave a certain way and eliminating the belief that I have to orgasm for sex to be enjoyable actually mad me enjoy it more!
There was also this belief that as a woman I shouldn’t initiate sex, I could hint that I wanted it. But initiation was a big no no. There was the fear of rejection but also I wanted to fell wanted and desired. Getting rid of that belief also led to some fun times with Kuba where I could actually initiate some fun sexy time 
I appreciate your honesty. I have experienced being attractive, I was a good looking kid before puberty and rosacea derailed things. I sometimes think it would have been easier if I had never experienced being attractive, to only know being ugly or the current state of a mixed bag of reactions. The ignorance of not having had a lot of attention at one point.
This sounds a horrible situation, as a father of two girls is my worse nightmare too. Not that it couldn’t happen to my son either, plenty of stories of boys being abused too. I am sorry you had to go through this.
Interesting, more prone to blame yourself rather than your partner. Like how in your other post you mentioned being annoyed with Kuba playing games etc, and that need to feel like your enough for someone (paraphrasing here couldn’t remember the exact details).
Who doesn’t love a lava lamp!
I have the fear of rejection with initiation, which hurt many relationships because the women in my life have probably had this same belief as you. Like I would be annoyed if I didn’t pick up the signs and the hints correctly.
Lucky ducks 