Just getting some thoughts down as they are occurring. It is making me sad that achieving everything I have ever wanted - peace, total carefreeness, unconditional happiness - will mean my demise. I will not be there to experience it.
Actualism was supposed to be the way “I” became the best version of myself. But “I” am the problem, “I” am in the way.
Josef: Just getting some thoughts down as they are occurring. It is making me sad that achieving everything I have ever wanted – peace, total carefreeness, unconditional happiness – will mean my demise. I will not be there to experience it.
Actualism was supposed to be the way “I” became the best version of myself. But “I” am the problem, “I” am in the way. (link)
Hi Josef,
You are not quite correct to say it “will mean my demise”. You already figured this out when you quoted Richard in your last post that it will mean the demise of ‘me’, the identity having hijacked the flesh-and-blood body Josef.
RICHARD: No … my solution is ‘self’-immolation – psychological and psychic suicide – and not what you are making it out to be (I follow the entirely sensible convention of using smart quotes when referring to the entity who has taken up a parasitical residence in the flesh and blood body). [Emphasis added]. (Richard, AF List, No. 29, 26 Feb 2002).
You experienced in the PCE that it is not only possible but far, far better to live without identity – even though you said you were “not ready for the experience at all”. Let the dust settle and digest it all before allowing yourself to become said over something that you can in fact rejoice about. Then you will see that it is still as sensible way to proceed becoming “best version of myself” by diminish the ‘self’ in the meantime, until you are fully ready to abandon your ‘self’ altogether.
Yes, the identity, of no fault of your own, is “the problem”, it has now become redundant because intelligence can take the place of the instinctual passions, which were necessary for the survival of early humans. You took up the actualism method in order to live in peace and harmony with your partner – which means you understood that the identity as it was could not do that.
And now, in nostalgic reminiscence about the ‘good old identity’, which only causes you trouble, you are “sad” that you may want to diminish it, even intending ‘your’ demise in order to “achieving everything I have ever wanted”.
This is not sensible.
When you get back to feeling good you will see that for yourself.
Richard: None of this mess is ‘my’ fault … ‘I’ was born like this. Now that ‘I’ realise this ‘I’ can willingly, cheerfully be in concordance. (…) ‘I’ can never, ever become perfect or be perfection. The only thing ‘I’ can do – the only thing ‘I’ need to do – is to say !YES! so that the already always existing perfection can become apparent. (Richard, List B, 25f, 22 June 2000).
Whilst I understand your shock and being overwhelmed by the implications of the experience you were “not ready for” – but then one is never ready for an experience outside of one’s normal parameters – why not instead appreciate and enjoy what has happened instead of filling the gap with the usual fearful and sorrowful feelings?
Just a suggestion.
Cheers Vineeto
Thanks Vineeto, I’m going through many different feelings and thoughts at the moment while digesting this experience. Going to wait till the dust settles before I write more
Josef: Thanks Vineeto, I’m going through many different feelings and thoughts at the moment while digesting this experience. Going to wait till the dust settles before I write more. (link)
Hi Josef,
Such ups and downs are natural after a potentially life-changing experience, especially as you already identified the next step – to put everything on a preference basis. For encouragement here is a short experiential report from AdamH how he succeeded in getting back to feeling good –
AdamH: Just took a little down then back up journey, reflecting now on just how masterful “I” am in terms of coming with convincing reasons to feel bad. Basically started down on this whole narrative about how I wasn’t living the life I should be and was covering up problems through actualism (and thus shouldn’t get back to feeling good).
After getting back to feeling good I just don’t agree with what I was believing at the time. The things I was worried about seem like microscopic unfairnesses in a sea of abundance. Feeling bad about them seems like cutting off my nose to spite my face. Plus it’s obvious that by feeling bad about those unfairnesses I just made, piled on more problems for myself and others by spreading unpleasant vibes. (link)
And one from Ian in December last year, how wonderful it is being increasingly happy and harmless and naïvely appreciating being alive –
Ian: And it really is so much fun. It feels like have crossed a threshold where now I am engaged in the play of increasing my enjoyment and appreciation, becoming happy and harmless, above/instead of my normal goals, because it is so much fun – fun now, to see the way I tick, to identify/ describe the different facets/ faces of being this identity, and gently let them slide in favour of more harmlessness.
There’s so much to it, so much wonderfulness – it seems every part of the experience of being alive is fascinating.
I’m having what seems to be somewhat cyclical (as my energy and attention waxes and wanes) waves of experiences of naiveté that I haven’t had before, where there is no enemy, where life is playful and joyful, where shimmers of amazement and wonder come to the fore, where there is literal pleasure trickling through my body in just being alive – sensuosity is also of the internal body, where feeling good really feels so good, where appreciation of my fellow human being (great phrase) and the acknowledgement of effort made and energy imparted by us as individuals and collectively comes easily.
Enjoying seeing where this is going. (link)
All the best
Cheers Vineeto
Josef: Just getting some thoughts down as they are occurring. It is making me sad that achieving everything I have ever wanted – peace, total carefreeness, unconditional happiness – will mean my demise. I will not be there to experience it.
Actualism was supposed to be the way “I” became the best version of myself. But “I” am the problem, “I” am in the way. (link)
Vineeto: Hi Josef,
You are not quite correct to say it “will mean my demise”. You already figured this out when you quoted Richard in your last post that it will mean the demise of ‘me’, the identity having hijacked the flesh-and-blood body Josef. (…)
You experienced in the PCE that it is not only possible but far, far better to live without identity – even though you said you were “not ready for the experience at all”. Let the dust settle and digest it all before allowing yourself to become said over something that you can in fact rejoice about. Then you will see that it is still as sensible way to proceed becoming “best version of myself” by diminish the ‘self’ in the meantime, until you are fully ready to abandon your ‘self’ altogether.
Yes, the identity, of no fault of your own, is “the problem”, it has now become redundant because intelligence can take the place of the instinctual passions, which were necessary for the survival of early humans. You took up the actualism method in order to live in peace and harmony with your partner – which means you understood that the identity as it was could not do that.
And now, in nostalgic reminiscence about the ‘good old identity’, which only causes you trouble, you are “sad” that you may want to diminish it, even intending ‘your’ demise in order to “achieving everything I have ever wanted”.
This is not sensible.
When you get back to feeling good you will see that for yourself.
Whilst I understand your shock and being overwhelmed by the implications of the experience you were “not ready for” – but then one is never ready for an experience outside of one’s normal parameters – why not instead appreciate and enjoy what has happened instead of filling the gap with the usual fearful and sorrowful feelings?
Just a suggestion. (link)
Josef: Thanks Vineeto, I’m going through many different feelings and thoughts at the moment while digesting this experience. Going to wait till the dust settles before I write more. (link)
Hi Josef,
Now that you had a few days to digest, and perhaps even were able to rememorate (link) the PCE you had, let me clarify what I wrote to you in my last message.
I had said in “you are not quite correct to say it ‘will mean my demise’.” This is factual only from the actual-world perspective where ‘my’ demise has already happened. From the feeling being’s frame of mind, however, ‘I’ will have to disappear in order for the actual world to become apparent – just as ‘you’ went into abeyance for the PCE to occur. So, it was a correct perception, once the PCE ended, that ‘you’, ‘who’ you feel and therefore think yourself to be, “will not be there to experience it” – the actual world.
That is the very reason you are encouraged to imitate the actual by enjoying the felicitous and innocuous feelings – those that require very little ‘self’ to flourish – and diminish the ‘good’ and ‘bad’ feelings, which are ‘self-enhancing and cause ripples in your own life and those of others. And the more you succeed in doing that the more ‘you’ enjoy the experience of being alive.
Yes, in the overall perspective “‘I’ am the problem” – and it is very informative to have a frame of reference of what you are doing and why, but it is also entirely in your hands how fast you want to proceed and how far you want to go … and still become/ be a friendly, amiable, peaceful, magnanimous, sensible, autonomous, appreciative, less-self-centric and overall enjoyable human being.
Feeling being ‘Vineeto’ used to say, “it’s the best game in town to play” –
‘Vineeto’: Having come that far in my contemplations I likened the whole path to freedom as a big balloon-popping party. Imagine a room full of balloons floating near the ceiling, in different colours, with different names of instincts, emotions, beliefs and conditioning written on them. The aim of the game is to pop every single balloon one by one by questioning, investigating and identifying the nature of the various beliefs, emotions and instincts. Once the last balloon is popped I am free. I imagine it to be light green, big, evasive, with fear written all over it. I need to keep it firmly in place, not getting distracted by doubt or other flight manoeuvres, and then – pop! That imagination changes the whole adventure from its heroic and dramatic frame into the thrilling and delightful journey it actually is. It also pulls the plug of making a big fuss about it. Mind you, I still consider it the best game to play, despite the other options you talked about in your letter. (Actualism, Vineeto, AF List, Irene, 14.10.1998)
Josef, as you can see by the date, it was still a decade away for ‘her’ to becoming actually free then (and ‘her’ imagination was not precisely in line with the facts – imagination never is) but it was overall a fun and sometimes a thrilling adventure all the way.
This one is more accurate and to the point –
‘Vineeto’: As you can see, actualism is all about diminishing one’s identity to the point where one becomes virtually happy and harmless such that ‘self’-immolation can happen – it has nothing to do with re-programming, re-interpreting, re-defining, re-labelling, re-shuffling, acquiring trinkets or replacing one part of one’s identity with another more shiny outfit – if applied with sincerity and intent the method of actualism will evoke actual change and that’s why many apparently find it too frightening to commit to.
But once you get over the hump, it’s the best game to play in town. (Actualism, Vineeto, AF List, No. 38e, 11.4.2004)
Cheers Vineeto