Yes, it’s not so easy sometimes to identify them retrospectively.
It did not happen to me in my time of meditations (Buddhism and MBRS). But since PCEs can happen at any time, of course they could happen while meditating (you can look on the AFT site for testimonies that it has happened). The problem with meditation is that it is more likely to lead to other states of consciousness than PCEs.
So the main question is - How do PCEs and ASCs actually differ? How can one distinguish one from the other? Is there also term for the “ordinary” consciousness (internal dialogue)?
Avoiding the classifications of psychology and psychiatry, and sticking to AF uses, I think these links will help you:
http://actualfreedom.com.au/library/topics/pce.htm
http://actualfreedom.com.au/library/topics/asc.htm
http://actualfreedom.com.au/library/topics/asc-pce.htm
Awesome, Miguel! Thank you very much.
Just reasking the question since it got “lost” while discussing the other topic.
I misread sorry, didn’t spot the “mentioned by Richard” part .
They are generated by a sense of “self” and the emotional spectrum of states possible within the human condition. When you have that feeling, there is a bad atmosphere here. Or that person is looking at me like he wants to punch me in the face. For me vibes have always related to information I have taken in from my surroundings, interpreting body language, visual cues, etc. There are vibes I have created from my own paranoia, and imagination too but there seems a different quality to these self generated vibes and those inferred or influenced by other people. Getting to experience a genuine scenario of mass hysteria was eye opening on the transmission of emotional states between people as well. Like a flock of animals fleeing a predator.
This section here in the Actualism and the Weird topic, @claudiu did a nice breakdown.
I have never experienced a spirtitual world therefore I am not able to really give a fair appraisal. How would you define and describe a spiritual world exactly? Do you see emotions and spirit as akin to one another?
RICHARD: All sentient beings, to a greater or lesser extent, are connected via a psychic web … a network of energies or currents that range from ‘good’ to ‘bad’. Feeling threatened or intimidated can result from the obvious cues – the offering of physical violence and/or verbal violence – or from the less obvious … ‘vibe’ violence (to use a ‘60’s term) and/or psychic violence. Similarly, feeling accepted can occur via the same signals or intimations. Power trips – coercion or manipulation of any kind – whether for ‘good’ or ‘bad’ purposes, are all psychic at root … the psychic currents are the most effective power plays for they are the most insidious (charisma, for example).
This psychic web that Richard is referring to is created as an epiphenomenon out of the instinctual emotions, which in an individual form a self and in a group form a social ‘self.’ Really they are the same thing, but in groups there are certain interactions occurring. Those interactions take place primarily in the form of the psychic web.
The psychic web is a very strange thing, that ‘Actualism and the Weird’ has good discussions about it, its implications, etc. as well as the AFT. Richard is very clear that it’s something that happens entirely on what he calls the plane of ‘reality’ (everything created by the instincts / self) with no physical cause whatsoever. At the same time, it definitely causes people to do some very strange and observable things, and at least in subjective reports, sometimes at a distance. How does it work? I have no idea!
The instinctual emotions and the self also create the entire spiritual world and ouvre, which is wide-ranging both in possible phenomena, description, and fantasies. So the psychic web could be viewed as an aspect of this spiritual world.
Confusing things further, it appears that the ‘actual world,’ which is made up of matter & energy (in the straightforward, scientific sense) is also capable of great weirdness, for example this description of Vineeto becoming fully free:
Then, at the moment she became essentially the same as me (how I have been, on my own, all these years) there was a tremendous upwards surge of that energetic immanence, in and around my head and shoulders region, of such a potency, of such a strength, as would previously (on some occasion) render me utterly passive, completely immobile, and scarcely able to bear with it, to contain its immensity.
On this occasion, however, it was able to flow freely – it was as if a circuit had been formed betwixt the two of us – and a second, equally potent, surge of that existential immanence followed the first (again in an upwardly direction in and around my head and shoulders region) a short while later.
Regarding that reference to a circuit having been formed, I am reminded of first being shown, as a child in High School, how a magnet produces a magnetic field by holding a sheet of paper over it and sprinkling iron-filings upon its surface; as there is a potent field now operating it is as if the two of us, a male and a female, are the ‘north’ and ‘south’ poles of a magnet; alternatively, the effect could perhaps be likened to the ‘anode’ and ‘cathode’ of a battery generating an electric current (and thus producing an electric field) when a circuit is completed.
Be that as it may be: those potent surges were of such a magnitude that a rather remarkable man on another continent experienced what he had earlier reported as being a ‘gentle energy’ (which he had further described, then, as being ‘totally harmless’) pouring into him, transfixing him in a sort of immobility (not of the body) and overwhelming him to such an extent that he communicated with me four days later, via email, and we were able to establish, with all due care taken in respect to time-zone differences, that the two events were congruent.
How does that work? Who knows! It’s weird!
It’s worth noting that many things that we take for granted at this stage of humanity are also extremely weird, such as: magnetism, electricity, gravity, neutron stars, radioactivity… I could go on. But because we’ve heard of them, have some understanding of how they work, they’ve become quotidian in our minds… it’s pretty funny really. These things are deeply weird too! But then again, all of existence is when you have the eyes for it.
It’s a very strange situation that we wander around dreaming in a physically-existing world of scintillating infinite depth (& breadth). Much to be discovered 
Hahaha. Exactly. It is refreshing to know that actualism also takes into consideration the ‘weirdness’ of the world and psychic experiences.
@henryyyyyyyyyy I really didn’t like what was said about this.
In fact, this exact quote you posted made me turn away from actualism for awhile. I didn’t accept there was any such phenomena to allow this to happen, it sent alarm bells in my head. In fact, I still don’t really get what he was talking about if I am honest.
How can they differentiate that it wasn’t just pure coincidence? In the end, it comes down to that same scepticism I always have of anybody’s subjective experience. Unless I ever experience anything of a similar nature I guess I will always be incredulous about what was described.
Ultimately, how best to live my day to day experience and remembering of PCE’s and EE’s brought me back.
I have studied Physics, so I am aware of the weird and wonderful in the quantum realm, non-locality, entanglement, decoherence, etc.
I have had some weird experiences too, that I can’t explain. Once I had a dream and this weird American man told me that I was about to receive an important phone call from my sister and she is not well. I woke up and instantly our house phone called. It was my sister (who was on holiday in Cyprus) and was really ill. She ended up in ITU due to extreme allergic reaction to something.
I have had moments of sensing my siblings when in random locations and then seeing them and what was weird when confirming with them they weren’t talking so I didn’t hear them. I have a terrible sense of smell, so I doubt I could smell them lol. I can acknowledge I have some subjective experiences I can’t explain. My natural response is to doubt the validity of my own experiences though.
What is there to doubt? You sensed your sibling out of sight/smell/hearing range, and then you saw them. Are you doubting that you had an experience of sensing them? Clearly not. Are you doubting you saw them soon after? Also not. So these things, as a fact, happened. And multiple times.
So you don’t doubt that it happened. This is a story you can tell people. Now as to what it means, it’s another question. Do you have a weird ability to sense your siblings? Well it’s unclear. You don’t remember the many times you didn’t sense them. Maybe you’re always “sensing” your siblings and forget the times you don’t see them after. But you’d probably remember that so maybe not. In any case is it repeatable , reproducible? Maybe not. Is it worth doing a scientific experiment to see if you can reproduce it? Again probably not.
So it’s a bit of a weird thing where the best you can do is say well this and that happened, I don’t know why, one possibility is I sensed something and maybe there’s some weird thing I can sense that’s not commonly known. What does it ‘mean’? What does it reveal of the world as we normally think of it? Unclear.
Now back to what Richard wrote, it’s quite similar. He experienced what he called this “energetic immanence” surging twice, and four days later he was able to see that a man on another continent had a corresponding experience of a “gentle energy … pouring into him”, that happened at the same time.
Is there doubt that it happened? Seems unlikely. It’s a weird thing that happened. How to explain it? What does it mean? What does it reveal? Unclear , unknown … but it doesn’t change the fact that it happened.
So what really is actually off putting about it? And I ask it knowing that I myself also found it off putting at first 
. But as I thought more about it, it’s just a report or observation of something that was experienced to happen.
In any case the PCE itself does reveal that the fact that this happened and Richard reported it, ultimately doesn’t have any cause for concern for me myself becoming actually free, because there is just so obviously nothing ‘wrong’ with it (the PCE).
Yes, it comes down to my not liking not knowing and not able to reproduce at whim and not able to know if it would ever happen again. Therefore, there is no nice and neat and closed off explanation. This is the problem for me, I seek to try and understand and have an explanation for everything. Including what arises in me. I noticed rather than just say, I feel sad or fearful, I try and put some deeper understanding and meaning and context to it. Rather than as is sometimes the case, it is unclear to me why I am feeling that way, or what triggered it. I don’t like admitting that I don’t know.
Things that are unclear or unknown I can see there is this part of me that wants to erase and censor such experiences, hence why I haven’t really discussed some of these things before.
For me though I always fear what I call the Fight Club effect, for those who haven’t seen the movie this is a Spoiler warning lol, a sort of fight club evolves from angry disenchanted men into a new group called Project Mayhem and they all have different jobs and tasks to carry out and kind of a like a terrorist group in a way, though not with the intent to kill but cause mayhem and take down the major credit card companies.
Part of joining that group is giving up your identity, you don’t have a name anymore. The person who started the group has mental health issues and split personality and so doesn’t agree with some of the rules he doesn’t realise his other persona created, he is unaware at this time. When a member of the group dies that he cared about it, it upsets him and he gets angry and starts telling the group the persons name. They are all confused because to them, a member of Project Mayhem doesn’t have a name. They can’t reconcile this contradiction, so one of the members states:
In death, a member of Project Mayhem has a name. His name is Robert Paulson . “His name is Robert Paulson”.
This becomes their chant and they all start chanting. Rather than process the contradiction they find a way to bypass it and continuing believing and behaving in the way that maintains the status quo of their group.
In my mind, I feared that I didn’t like what Richard was saying here but I was just finding a different frame for it so I could continue the status quo of practicing actualism.
In actualism, an actually free person can experience an energetic immanence and somebody not within a local distance, not with sensory input can experience a corresponding gentle energy pouring into them simultaneously.
I have reached a similar conclusion. That ultimately it is a report that I can’t verify and have never experienced either so there is nothing I can really do it with it. Nothing about it contradicts my experiences with felicity, EE’s or PCE’s though.
Sorry, how does the PCE itself reveal the fact that this happened to Richard? I had all my PCE’s before this event, so I can’t relate. As in, there is no lie/deception in a PCE?
Ah not that. Tricky grammar, that I find often happens when I talk about actualism lol:
i.e. The PCE shows that, it doesn’t particularly matter, with regards to the ‘integrity’ of the PCE, whether this thing that Richard reported happened.
Thanks for clarifying, I can see how it can be read differently. The good old ambiguous English language.
Yes, hence we reached the same conclusion.
In a way, I could never prove the subjective weirdness that has happened to me under the influence of anxiety. I have had some terrifying experiences that I think some people would never believe. This one, I had in the hypnagogic state whilst having a panic attack, like my whole system just crashed with exhaustion and I was drifting in a state of panic and sort of dreaming and awake dreaming, it was messed up. I was dreaming I was in these dimensions of suffering and there was no escape from suffering and death was actually utter transcendence into suffering. It was bizarre.
Hehe then that’s the funny thing. Imagine you’re an alien reading reports of these things called “humans”. What is more bizarre from an outside perspective?
It would seem #2 is the far more bizarre one. Yet everyone reading this will think it’s more normal because it’s something that is usual for us – these hallucinations, be they while fully dreaming or half-awake. And then #1 is what puts people off of actualism!!! Haha.
The point I’m making, maybe poorly, is that actually it’s the human condition that is far more bizarre than actual freedom / actuality. It’s just that the actual world is unfamiliar to us… so it can appear more bizarre at first.
Also what’s there to “prove” per se about this? It’s clear you had the experience… do you mean to ‘prove’ whether the content is true, e.g. that death is transcendence into suffering?
Sounds like a magic mushroom trip I had years ago. I remember at the peak of it I became a spirit floating through the universe for eternity, I had no beginning or end and it seemed like I have always been there separated from everyone and everything, not a fun time 
Yes, I remember thinking had I found Hell, but there was no Devil lol. I can see in myself that I decide the validity of things based on them being something I subjectively have experienced or somebody I value and trust having subjectively experienced or that I desire or feel good about such a possible state. When something didn’t fall into these areas, it would be this uncomfortable…well what is that then.
Yes, for sure.
To prove that it is an hallucination and not a genuine experience of something tangible. Then I could demonstrate to others that the subjective experiences that have become part of their beliefs, like astral projection, etc could be shown to be not tangible but generated by a brain, a self created illusion. This goes back to what I was saying in my journal regards that long discussion you and others had with Rick regarding facts and feelings. I wish there was some way to make the subjective, objective.
Ah got it. Yea seems the only way in this universe for someone to see something is subjective is for they themselves to see it. If they don’t wanna see it, they won’t … …
But some things can only be understood experientially rather than seeing it, if that makes sense.