Emp: Hi!
Vineeto: I do enjoy reading your lively reports and I am pleased you not only understand what I wrote about real-world time and actual time but that you had worked it out yourself already.
Emp: Maybe I do actually need to write more so I don’t leave you typing things to me that I’ve already understood. OTOH you express yourself far better and more precise, and I enjoy chatting with you. I’m genuinely trying not to do the scattergun approach but there’s so much happening that I can barely fit in a fraction of a day’s worth of reflecting and experiencing, and I forget half of it.
Hi Emp,
I enjoy chatting with you, and your “scattergun approach” seems to be appropriate to what is happening at present – the human condition is such a vast field of exploration, and it would not only be difficult but counterproductive to try and stream-line it when experiences and explorations tumble forth, thereby losing its naiveté and vivaciousness. If I write something you already know, that is ok, it’s par for the course.
Vineeto: You certainly shouldn’t whittle down your social identity. The suggestion is that you can have a close look at those social identity issues if and when they interfere with your general enjoyment and appreciation of being alive, and only do so when your pure intent is firmly in place.
Regarding any other tools of the actualism method you have possibly entered into your ‘should’-section, remember what Richard said repeatedly during the Dona&Alan visit that there are no conditions to becoming actually free. As such there is no reason to put yourself under any performance pressure in the name (or excuse) of actualism – it is only counterproductive to naïvely having fun. Having said that, I remember well that ‘Vineeto’ at times put herself under a similar pressure – apart from genuinely wanting to be actually free.
Emp: Ah, so, about me writing more, here’s where it would’ve helped if I’d added this to the convivium report.
I think I was the one that pottered up to Geoffrey on the third(?) day to point out that I’d seen that there’s no “pedigree” in actualism. You don’t have to serve up who you are, where you grew up, who you studied with, what you’ve accomplished as some kind of admittance fee. For some reason I’d taken on a lot of assumptions about my own capacity and eligibility, and this was a fairly big one that I hadn’t noticed until it just fell away. The fact that there are no conditions is absolutely amazing.
I had a lot of fun reading through the links you provided, and given that I’ve been at this for a long time there were lots of memories connected with the writings, not the least how I thought about actualism back then. I remember seeing it as a very linear path with milestones and prerequisites and I’m amazed at how this has changed and how sensible it is that it’s, again, right here and right now. The linear progression thinking also kept it in some indefinite future for me, and I’m quite glad to be rid of that. Just the mere thought of the actual always being right under my feet, like a golden path (no idea why I’ve started remembering the old cartoon The Mysterious Cities of Gold and associating it with this whole adventure, but here we are) makes me feel like a giant wave is cresting below me and carrying me forward relentlessly.
It was probably ‘Peter’s’ and ‘Vineeto’s’ doing that it had the appearance of a “very linear path” because that is how most feeling beings approach almost everything new they encounter. I remember ‘Vineeto’ in the beginning having great trouble to wrap ‘her’ head around that now is this only moment being alive (which also meant becoming actually free will happen now – very scary too).
Indeed, there is neither a “pedigree” nor any “admittance fee” in actualism, and it is enormously liberating to have this really sunk in. Your description of “a giant wave is cresting below me” reminds me of Richard’s own description –
Richard: I remember describing it as ‘living at the cutting-edge of reality’. (Richard, AF List, Alan-b, #etheric).
Or more explicit –
Richard: I would say to myself: ‘This is my only moment of being alive … I am actually here doing this reading of these words now’. The past – although it was actual whilst it was happening – is not happening now … and never will again. A past peak experience can never be repeated … it is useful inasmuch as it bestows the requisite confidence that it is possible to experience the purity of the perfection of life here and now … but that is it, finish. One slips into this moment in time and this place in space by being aware that all this that is happening is happening for the very first time and that I have never been here before doing this. In fact: I have never been here before. In everyday terminology this moment in time is the ‘cutting-edge of reality’. Who knows what will happen next as ‘the future’ does not exist until this moment happens.
If this realisation is not thrilling I would like to know what is! (Richard, AF List, Vineeto, 5 Aug 1998).
The fact that you write that it is “carrying me forward relentlessly” shows that your concerns about missing “pressure” or “inertia” are merely fabricated by an identity who wants to maintain control of the process via the time-old (instinctual) tools of ‘carrot and stick’ – but habitually more ‘stick’ than ‘carrot’, by your description.
Emp: I feel a bit like I’m in limbo though; I’m used to using my performance anxiety and external pressure to keep things going. I’m also used to receding into inertia when not whipped by external circumstances. I currently feel like I can’t go back, but I don’t know how to move forward, except one step at a time. I sometimes wake up scared that I’ll go back to normal and forget all about this without pressuring myself to go on. There’s no map, there’s nothing predictable about this. I read through the vintage Vineeto you sent regarding the mad scientist phase (vintage Vineeto is a term of endearment for me here, I remember enjoying your writings immensely during a time when what Richard wrote was far too dense and confrontational for me, and getting re-acquainted with this discussion was a hoot) and I could recognise almost everything. Doing this on my own is very disorienting at times. Whenever I want to get back to my old habits – seeking reassurance from others, emotional support, venting, even asking ChatGPT – I realise that I actually don’t want to. The door to normality isn’t closed but I’m sure as hell not going to help in keeping it open.… but it takes a lot to stand on your own and just go for it.
Ha, I like your term ‘vintage Vineeto’ and understand that Richard’s writing was (on occasion?) “too dense and confrontational”. I forget mostly how mindboggling it had been for ‘her’, but then ‘she’ read the mailing list every day and had regular meetings with Richard, where some of the questions could be cleared up. Particularly extracting ‘herself’ from the spiritual beliefs and loyalties took several months, but after an outstanding PCE (link) many, many things fell into place.
Emp: I’m also used to emotions having this predictable structure and map to it… I don’t even know how to describe it; going by emotions there’s a linearity and a safety. I know what I’ll get – it’ll always be disappointment, but I know what I’ll get. It’s easy to communicate in emotions, it’s easy to “map yourself out” in emotions; they have a recognisable shape and form and it’s easy to navigate society with emotions. I know it’s not easy, but it’s “easy” as reverting to norm is always “easy”. This has been the hardest for me to describe; just as allowing pure intent is such a weird manoeuvre for someone who’s used to forcing everything, moving forward without using emotional pressure is one hell of a mindfuck. It’s this constant moving out of the way and allowing and I don’t have that in me reflexively yet; sometimes it takes a while to get back to a good baseline. I want to work hard, to toil and to force but that’s not how it’s done and it would only reinforce “me”.
Ha, I gain the impression from your words that pure intent is happening, and humour too, no longer waiting for your express permission (“makes me feel like a giant wave is cresting below me and carrying me forward relentlessly”) and all of the above-described emotions are to distract and discourage you from what it already happening, but to no avail! Your last paragraph in this post confirms it even more –
Emp: “… this is where I’m supposed to go, this is my destiny and there really is nowhere else to be”.
Vineeto: As a feeling being ‘I’ want to be confirmed, sometimes desperately, in ‘my’ existence as a contingent ‘being’, and it’s difficult to then recognize a genuine caring from the other unless it’s provided with all the trappings of sympathy, empathy and love (trappings, which would include the ties which promise a permanent continuation of your care). Yet the only close-to-actual care you can give is to disentangle yourself from the ties of “the trap of compassion” and the guilt of loyalty as much as you can. The more you do the more you will be able to give them your full attention devoid of resentment, a freely given care and appreciation to a fellow human being – simply because they are a fellow human being and not because you owe them something. (You may find Richard’s correspondence regarding near-actual-caring informative).
Emp: Yeah, this one has proven to be a big one for me. I keep thinking I’ve resolved something and then it’ll rear its head again, or the situation will change. I can handle it so far, but empathy and care are hard to deal with for me and coupled with guilt it turns slightly radioactive. I can sometimes get so hamstrung by this that I have to remind myself to move and actually do something to get out of the inherent “stuckness” of these fears and the rumination. It helps a lot to think about what’s is actually actual, as a lot of the scenarios I’m thinking up aren’t happening right now. It still feels like I’m constantly bouncing between trying to avoid appeasement while doing the reasonable thing, while also not being affected by someone else’s emotions and suffering in the process. I guess this is yet another situation where I’ve read too much about it and not experienced enough; I know logically that everything you’re saying makes sense, but I haven’t seen it properly and I need to show myself that I can do this without “me”. It’s a slow and gradual peeling of the layers.
Again, I can only suggest to remember to be a friend to yourself to neither push or criticise what you think and do but rather be aware of it and, if possible, keep you hands in your pockets when emotions well up too strong. A lot of change can happen in the background such as “a day’s worth of reflecting and experiencing, and I forget half of it”. Some changes take time to settle and then suddenly appear as practical changes on the surface – a bit like osmosis (fig. gradual, usu. unconscious assimilation or absorption of ideas, knowledge, etc. ~ Oxford Dictionary).
Emp: By the way, there was something that Geoffrey mentioned that really stuck with me (and I’d like anyone who reads this to not mistake it for something that it isn’t, because I think it might be very easy to abstract this reasoning into an excuse for splitting, instead of actually seeing what it means); “I” think I’m needed for the protection of this body, and I need to show myself that that’s not the case. It’s a fucked up caring, in a sense, thinking that the body will never be safe unless “I” am there watching out for it, controlling it, monitoring it. I’ve seen it in the small things but there’s a lot of fear blocking trying it out on the bigger things.
ETA: I took a break from writing and when I came back, I realised that these last couple of paragraphs were emotionally very heavy… and I’m wondering if this is really such a big deal as I’m making it out to be. I’m getting a whiff of drama created for the sake of staying alive. Anyway.
It is a big deal because this is still a grand pioneering adventure – not only going against your own instinctual programming, emotional intuition, life-long habituation and socialisation, but also contrary to what everyone around you is aspiring to. But then, that is what pioneers do; explore new territory (in human consciousness) and make exciting, universally beneficial discoveries regarding peace on earth, for you and for the benefit of everyone. Give yourself credit for what you are doing.
Emp: I’ll keep writing if that helps. On a less heavy note, back to the fun of reading all the links. It’s amazing how different everything reads now that I have access/ a connection to pure intent to the extent I do. As I mentioned previously, a lot of what Richard wrote was too dense and confrontational to me, and now all of it makes sense, especially the word choices and the order of words. There was a quote from Richard that I wanted to put here, but now I can’t for the life of me find it; it was a description a bit like the numbered list on Dona and Alan’s Questions page, but it was in free-flowing text and described to a tee the process I’m currently using.
This is great to read. Is it perhaps something like the first section here? I’ll be interested when you find it.
Emp: Also, I’d like to emphasise this for anyone who has the same tendencies as me:
Vineeto: You certainly shouldn’t whittle down your social identity. The suggestion is that you can have a close look at those social identity issues if and when they interfere with your general enjoyment and appreciation of being alive, and only do so when your pure intent is firmly in place.
Emp: “pure intent is firmly in place” – I have done this without pure intent in place and it’s deeply unpleasant. I can add it to my gallery of useless achievements, but I would not recommend it to anyone.
Thank you for this confirmation and insight.
Emp: Anyway, I’ve been having so much fun writing. Yesterday destiny kept popping up whenever I was contemplating. It’s neither here nor there but I kept circling back to how it seemed like this is where I’m supposed to go, this is my destiny and there really is nowhere else to be. I know “I” can’t technically go in the end, but the wave keeps adding this forward pressure that I keep wanting to ride. It’s exhilarating, fun, joyful, exuberant, the biggest adventure, and the deepest laughter, you could imagine (I don’t want to anthropomorphize it, but the welling causes the laughter and so it’s as close as I can get to describing it). (link)
Ah, that sounds wonderful – it feels good, it makes sense (in fact it’s the only thing that makes sense) and the PCEs confirm it is actual, perfect and what/where you always wanted to be. Enjoy the ride of the biggest adventure of your life.
I just went onto the back deck for some evening air and the almost-full moon is reflected on the water, its reflection rippled by a gentle breeze. The air is soft and friendly and it’s just wonderful to be here.
Much appreciation for an enjoyable conversation.
Cheers Vineeto