Elgin's Journal

@elgin

I don’t think I’ve welcomed you to the forum yet. So… welcome! And thank you for the quality of your contributions here.

About your missed ‘opportunity’…

Usually people underestimate the ‘pull’ that is necessary to self-immolate, they read something like “you have to want it like you’ve never wanted anything in your life before” and figure that what is needed is a tremendous ‘push’. So they go for it with all the will they can muster, all tense and with furrowed eyebrows, trying everything they can think of, thinking that they just need one second of success, one opportunity at the psychic gun trigger, one tremendous act of will… and either nothing happens, or most usually an ASC. ‘I’ was, for a long time, a big culprit of that attitude. I described it as running towards a wall and hitting my head, again, and again… I just had to run faster, I thought, hit the wall harder, and the wall would break. “You think I can’t do it eh, watch me!”

It seems that you’re not committing that mistake. Your description of the ‘pull’ sounds good to me. It might very well be that you’ve indeed had a ‘window’ there. But it might be that you’re underestimating the ‘push’ that is needed. Let me be clear, I’m not talking about some ‘act of will’ of the “tense and with furrowed eyebrows” kind, I’m talking about the “wanting it 100%”, the “going for it”, the “not giving up until it’s done”. In the same spirit of ‘daring’ that must have been present in your actualism for you to reach such a point.

In Craig’s report, you might remember he had decided to self-immolate during his lunch break, that day. But the lunch break was coming to an end, and it hadn’t happened. He came back to his office. How easily could he have been pondering what was ‘missing’, what he had done wrong, how easily he could have given up, content (and somewhat relieved) to have been ‘close’. But he wasn’t ready to give up. So he went for it with all he had, again, right there on his office chair. And it happened.

In my report, you might remember that at one point, in the wood, I saw the ‘veil’. There was an ‘opportunity’ there (and I seem to remember that Richard talks about such missed ‘opportunities’ of that kind). But there was “last second resistance” and the window closed. After, while coming back home, there was a gentle slope I could have taken, a quite definite tendency appeared to ponder on the missed opportunity, to start making theories on what was missing, to put things to rest until ‘next time’, with some relief. But I wasn’t giving up. I definitely wasn’t giving up. And it’s at that point that what might be called the activation of altruism came into play, and that it happened.

To be clear, the ‘pull’ is absolutely fundamental. People’s tendency (‘their’ tendency) to underestimate it is why it definitely has to be overemphasized. There has to be a connexion to pure intent of such a 'bandwidth" that the actual has to be right there, plain obvious and resplendent. But then it has to be allowed. It’s not just about waiting for it to do its thing. One might think that, of course, one wants it 100%, that it’s a given, and just sit and wait for that something ‘outside’ to do its thing - but there is in that attitude a hope that it won’t, a contentment with getting close (“am I not a good actualist, look how close that was!”) that you might see as quite obvious, if you look for it with sincerity.

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I have experienced a strong pull at times, though not as intensely as you describe here. Or maybe it was and I forgot lol. I experienced it like a “sweet spot” (as in a Goldilocks zone) of pushing/pulling.

If I’m out of the zone and I push too much then I don’t get anywhere, it’s me pushing me and I fall in on myself — I finally realized this won’t really work about 2 years ago but I did it a lot leading up to that.

If I don’t push enough then nothing happens of course.

But when I’m in the zone it’s as if a “new” kind of “pushing” is obviously available. And it isn’t really pushing. But it is really really going for it with all my intent and energy. And in the zone it works! There is a far-out-of-the-ordinary level of things happening, getting ‘sucked’ in towards actuality more and more. Haha now that I describe it it sounds similar.

For me so far it has similarly fizzled out. Usually I hit a wall of a new issue or objection and then I step back, then I have to figure it out. Interestingly the usual objections are blown past and sincerely obliterated quite quickly. But then there’s a sticky one which doesn’t get blown away… and that’s the thing to look at.

Other times I think it fizzles from just a lack of willingness to go further. It’s like “oh wait this would actually work”… and then I hesitate.

I have had the experience a few times of having had a ‘window’ of self-immolation. It’s like oh I could just go there… but I don’t! I don’t know if they were “genuine” windows, but it was my experience of it. The actually free seem to agree that it can happen at any time.

And there was one time where I actually felt ‘my’ center shift downwards and I experienced it like ‘I’ was going away at last … … and then I pulled back!!! So I wasn’t ‘ready’ then, in hindsight :smile:.

As for right now it seems I’m in a similar boat. I’m not ‘dissatisfied’ enough to get off my laurels. But by dissatisfied I don’t mean miserable… I don’t think being miserable is the best sort of motivation per se. And that would mean you have to be miserable before you can enjoy and appreciate ‘more’ lol. Which isn’t the case. But I seem to be lacking a sort of impetus to get closer. Life is generally quite good though. The key seems to be of course that the PCE is infinitely better. But the constant daily butting up against myself and others , the friction of being a feeling-being interacting with other feeling-beings, is actually a pretty good motivator to do something, keep being more sincere and more happy and harmless.

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Thinking about it a bit more this must only be part of it. Cause all else being equal it’s obvious that doing the better thing is better. It’s easy to buy the higher quality coffee than the worse quality one lol. So there is something or somethings (or some one :wink: ) preventing the simple / obvious choice.

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James: I can relate to this. I feel good for long periods of time and there is no sense of urgency to self - immolate. I have never wanted it like a drowning man wants air.

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Richard: … one has to want it like one has never wanted anything else before … so much so that all the instinctual passionate energy of desire, normally frittered away on petty desires, is fuelling and impelling/propelling one into this thing and this thing only (‘impelling’ as in a pulling from the front and ‘propelling’ as in being pushed from behind). There is a ‘must’ to it (one must do it/it must happen) and a ‘will’ to it (one will do it/it will happen) and one is both driven and drawn until there is an inevitability that sets in. Now it is unstoppable and all the above ceases of its own accord …one is unable to distinguish between ‘me’ doing it and it happening to ‘me’.
One has escaped one’s fate and achieved one’s destiny.

To this one might add that the other instinctual passions are also at play in the lead-up to the event. For if one is to go for it whole, then it’s not only the instinctual passion of desire that is fueling this approach, but also those of fear (in the form of thrill), of nurture, and of aggression (as daring, and even some kind of ‘recklessness’, which I was outlining in my post above).

To further exemplify this last point, consider the scope of what is to be done, and the daring involved in going for it.

Richard: To put it into a physical analogy, it was as if I were to gather up my meagre belongings, eradicate all marks of my stay on the island, and paddle away over the horizon, all the while not knowing whence I go … and vanish without a trace, never to be seen again.

Geoffrey: I would indeed gladly die right now, gladly give away all I am, all I ever was, all I’ve done and felt since I was born

Srinath: I would need to truly die. The enormity of this dawned on me suddenly like it never had before. The enormity of what I had to give up. It took my breath away.

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Maybe you will find useful the reflections and suggestion made by @Srinath to a similar comment I made, although it is good to keep in mind the full context (which you can find in Virtual Freedom vs. Rapid Method - #5 by Miguel) and that for your case his suggestions could be different:

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I would give this a heart or an emoji but it seems inadequate :smiley: . And then posting this message saying that, seems “pretentious” lol. But here it is anyway :upside_down_face:

Thank you everyone for all your contribution. There is so much to take in for the moment. I will need some time to reflect on all this and to respond adequately when I have more time for it.

This is the thing which is standing out to me in the moment. It resonated strongly with me. It hit something. I need to look deeply into this. I realize now that I have begun to “persuade” myself that the “force” is out there reaching me when I’m ready. I see now this will not happen just by itself. I was indeed “hoping”.

Again, thank you.

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HI Elgin, as noted by geoffrey, your contributions here are very valuable.
So keep posting and talk about any and all issues that is related to Actual Freedom application
of the method. Every bit of your writing and others in this forum, brings up new insight and
new question for all of us.

With regards to your “missed opportunity”, I was thinking ( probably I am ways off the mark);
could it have something to do with you being “honorable”. Maybe you would feel guilty to leave humanity and abandon it ( that may seem like a dishonorable thing to do ) ???

BTW:
Your wonderful reply to me about "having intend … " and investigation and Eaatmoba, has
been very helpful, thank you Elgin.

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First thank you @geoffrey for your friendly welcome and the very helpful and informative explanations regarding my opportunity/event.

I really had to understand you first to respond adequately. Reading your response for the first time was not really clicking with me, but I thought a lot about it. I went back and read all the reports of becoming actually free again (but I didn’t find the one with the office chair) to then compare it with my own notes and experiances. I misunderstood several things completely!

This was definitely the problem I was facing. The push for me was done before the pull!
So in my mind I had done ‘my’ thing, my deed, all I could at that time. The single-minded focus, my whole attention before the pull was dedicated to end me.
I was absolutely dedicated. Nothing could take away my attention at that time. I couldn’t think about anything else, even if I wanted to. I was indeed surprised by myself and thought back then: “So I really, really want this!? Ok!”

The thing was now happening and I was “ready”. The pull was so damn strong that I could’t believe for a second that it was not strong enough to outright “kill” me. So I just took the ride/slide. I was sure, this is my end. It will kill me. That’s it. By folks!

It was after that first pull decreased in intensity that I, well, panicked a bit. I understood that it can fade again, that my death was not certain. It became a bit desperate later on. I just didn’t know what to do, how to reach it again. I’m not to sure if I was not ready then, because I was so damn ready! It felt so true and honest to me. I could’t conciously detect any resistance from me back then.

But I got it wrong. Completely wrong. This was “just” the pull and I did, well, nothing. I didn’t push at all. I wanted it to go faster, to die faster, but that’s not a push by any means. What for? It’s game over, man!

At that time I was under the impression that only Richard was actually free, while Peter and Vineeto would probably take forever. I knew that there would be a last resistance. That “resistance” for me was the moment I realized that this pull was not something PCE-related, but that it unmistakably pulled me straight into oblivion. It sure came as a shock, but I could within just a few seconds adopt and take that slide. From there on it was maybe the best time of my life. I have never experianced something so thrilling and exciting. I wrote back then: “I am shitting my pants while feeling exellent.”

And then I read this:

And yeah, I was absolutely not experiencing this.
All this happend for you while the pull was already happening. It was the last step, the last decision which never, ever occurred to me. So I was dancing with death, but I never faced it in the end. That’s a bummer for sure. It makes so much sense now. I was hoping for an easy way out I guess.

This is so good to know. It solves so many problems I was facing. I just couldn’t understand all of this. Now it all makes so much sense to me. What a great and helpful post goeffrey :slightly_smiling_face:

After that event I was pretty down. Like a dog licking his wounds wanting to go home. It took me quite a few weeks to completely recover from that “loss”. But all that isn’t important anymore. It happend. I learnt from it. I still don’t know if I could do it this time around. I’m much better prepared then in the past though. I went back to the basics after that and managed to feel even better than before on a constant basis.
I’m going a softer route this time around. I don’t push myself that hard anymore. First feeling good, feeling harmless, feeling energetic. I want to have this stable. I’m looking to care more for people around me, to share my attention and time with them. To have more intimicy with them. This will take time, but I really don’t mind. I want to have this link established. I’m taking an overall broader approach and I think it suits me quite well.

Thanks @FrankN.

I thought about it, but no. I don’t think so. I think it was a major catalysator for me back then. As far as I was concerned back then only Richard was free. I made links to the selected correspondence of Richard, Peter, Vineeto and the Glossary. That’s it. Nothing else. The rest of the site was just confusing and too disordered for my taste. My search for answers started after that event. Then I was looking deeper into this whole stuff and there I learned that Peter and Vineeto and other people were already free. I was pretty much dissapointed about it, because it meant that I had failed. I wanted to be the first free human beeing after Richard to blow up that psychic web for good. I saw myself as some kind of special, the one who could actually do it. The others were just talk no walk. I was pretty cocky back then. Honor and pride were very important to reach that step for me. I had this experience were I saw that I was directly responsible for all the insanity in the world and I couldn’t stand it. I had to do something about it. That let me into this whole gritty-serious phase and then to the super clean and clear phase.

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Hummmm just something I noticed in myself. I often feel intensely bad and upset after a particularly nice EE or PCE ends. Or maybe sometimes when self immolation didn’t happen.

But what I’ve come to recognize is not that im feeling bad I didn’t succeed. It’s that I’m pissed off about what my true nature is - a rotten insubstantial feeling-being that really has to go. So it’s like a digging in my heels. Like “fuck I guess I really can’t somehow survive this self immolation business”. I wonder if it’s the same for you but you’re misinterpreting the direction of the emotion?? Just a thought :slight_smile:

Hi claudiu: the above statement means what?
Like “I” hope ( digging in my heels ) to be able to self immolate and still keep “myself” intact ?

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Yes exactly. Then I see that I can’t and that spoils ‘my’ plans (to keep existing). And thus the being pissed at first lol. Of course the ‘me’ not existing part is the whole point so it’s only a temporary setback.

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Lol, good point Claudiu! :smile:

Yeah, there is definitely something. If I were to look deeper I may very well find something like that, as Geoffrey implied as well. I mean logically it doesn’t make any sense. Why would a self be dissapointed by surviving another day? That’s what I basically am - a survior. It doesn’t add up, but I still need a direct seeing of it. It’s not like I can just paste an answer over it. I have an extra light lit up for this thing. But it’s suprisingly difficult to get behind it. Like I would be cool to admit a defeat, but backing out? No way! There is still this honor/pride thing which is swirling around. I basically want to pet myself for my “achievement”. “You have done good boy. Wuff, Wuff!” :smile:
But yeah, it would be really shitty when this pops up in the wrong moment. I see you doggy!

This was my first and only self-immolation situation so far. I never experianced something alike. I had some weird ego-dissolution experiances in my spiritual days, but thats it. So I don’t know what reactions are normal or to be expected. For me it was, ahem, surprising that the method… well, actually worked! It was just a theorie, some kind of distant thing I had ideas about, but I could’t grasp it until it actually hit me.

With PCE’s its different for me. I feel very light and good when they are over. The atmosphere and energy of the event lasts for days, weeks and sometimes even months. But of course I often craved for a PCE or an EE. It’s when I felt to be in a rut or somehow disconnected from pure intent. When the clouds don’t seem to move away and I’m on my own again. In such moments I like to read about PCE’s to remind me what is “out there”. Then I’m pretty soon back to: “Hey clouds, nice try, but you can’t fool me!”

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I wonder if you could use that desire for achievement to push yourself over the line toward becoming free? What could be a greater accomplishment than that? That way it’s less of an obstacle than it gives you additional momentum.

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I think so too Henry. But I have decided to take a slower and broader approach. I have to acknowledge that I was not ready, that I “lost energy” on the last mile. There has to be a reason for that. Since this event which happend about 7-8 months ago I haven’t had any PCE. When I feel I’m near it I can feel a split-second resistance. It’s there. I feel it very precisely. There is a pushback.
I think the reason is that this whole event scared the shit out of me. Sure, I was able to adjust and enjoy it, but still. I feel I came to close too soon. This may also be a clever trick to waste more time, but it doesn’t feel like it. Sometimes I even think this event did me a disservice. Sure, I have learnt a lot since then and feel better on a constant basis, but it’s like there is a new fear I have to tackle now. Something which was missing before. I guess it’s the knowledge that this “stuff” really, really works.
I couldn’t get behind it so far.

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You’re ringing bells for me, something similar happened for me/has happened for me after every PCE I’ve ever had, which is that I’ve had niggling doubts around desires for girls… those desires were not yet settled.

I spent maybe years trying to myopically focus on becoming free while all the long I had a powerful current of energy toward sexuality. I think I made a mistake by doggedly trying to ignore/repress that energy (desire isn’t actualism, right? Wrong!!!). In the last couple of months I’ve been allowing myself to use that energy, explore that topic which I sincerely desire in my very bones, and hitch it to actualism however and whenever I can.

What I started to catch onto was that I was generally quite dissociated and discouraged in my life, and this made it very difficult to generate the necessary energy to do actualism well, let alone to become free.

I knew I needed to generate more energy, and this has proven just the ticket. Now all that’s left is to bring up the sincerity & naivete to match.

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I’m realizing I skipped over the specifics of what you describe, that that fear is related to it ‘really, really working’ and not being ready to cross that threshold.

Maybe that’s something that having more PCEs could answer? You have to ‘try before you buy,’ to have the confidence that it’s worth it.

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Sure, but a PCE could lead to my demise, you see? :smiley:

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Maybe there is some security in knowing that ‘you’ are still the one that has to make that choice? No one can make you do it, but you