Love REALLY got me

[henryyyyyyyyyy]

@Josef

I am not obligated to stay in this situation (though I find I cannot leave because of the emotional bonds).

I think this statement has a few revealing layers in it

Yes, you have the option of no longer being ‘in this relationship.’

However, you are having this current difficulty with feeling abandoned/neglected while the relationship is continuing.

So you’re currently feeling abandoned/neglected, while also feeling unable to leave (because of the emotional bonds).

This puts you in a trap (as @Shashank describes).

The key is that the emotional bonds are also creating the feeling of abandoned-neglected.

You feel ‘attached’ to her, and therefore times when she is not around, or not expressing interest in you, or placing her attention elsewhere, must feel threatening, because they fail to reify those bonds.

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@Josef

The time we spend together is wonderful, I just wish we’d spend much more of it together.

This reminds me of a date I went on a few months back:

We had a great time together, the conversation was free-flowing and she seemed to like me. I was thinking that it would work out! But something funny happened partway through our date: a couple of her friends came along to say hi. I noticed that she had that same easy manner with them… she was just a relaxed person, she mostly liked people and has an easy time getting along with everyone. She turned out to not want to pursue more dates, and I learned something.

The date seemed like ‘something special’ to me, because it was one of the easier interactions I had ever had with a girl I was attracted to. But for her, it was just another interaction, because she was having nice interactions like that all the time.

Could it be that something similar is happening with you and your partner? You are both having a wonderful time when you’re together, but perhaps she is also enjoying those other parts of her life, to the point that she will prioritize those other things.

Can you say the same? What is your life like when she is not around? That may be the reason for feeling abandoned & neglected… it only makes sense to feel that way when one is in some kind of ‘trouble’ physically or emotionally.

[Josef]

How do I quote a part of someone’s post? I use block quote but I cannot get the name above it or the expand/collapse buttons.

[henryyyyyyyyyy]

select the text you want to quote and there should be a pop-up ‘quote’ button

[Josef]

Wow, thank you all for the great replies.

@Kub933

I don’t know maybe it’s just me but this looks like under-selling of what it would actually be like. It is looking at an ‘actualist relationship’ as a concept which opposes a loving relationship instead of discovering what it would actually be like to live.

I would replace that description with something along the lines of :

I’ve begun to consider a third alternative, one where forever swigging from the good to the bad is replaced with mutual delight, playfulness, intimacy and freedom. Where instead of Love that is forever fickle there is an intimacy which provides a stable baseline from which we interact.

You hit the nail on the head. I wrote this post when I was pretty down/angry, but later I (somehow) managed to get myself feeling good again. And when I was feeling good, I didn’t care about any of the above. Not in a callous way, but I was enjoying myself so it didn’t matter much whether I was being neglected or not. It occurred to me that this may be THE answer. What I wrote here indeed seems like a withdrawal/retreat, an expression of this anger. I know it’s not the right direction because when I was feeling good, I actually WANTED to engage with people (and her) even more. So the actualism method is not opposite the normal way, but a much better version of it. The key characteristic was the lack of malice/resentment. It’s like I dropped all past hurts. They didn’t matter.

@Shashank

With love, there is also what I call “the trap of love”…there is a delusional feeling that aah maybe this time around with this new lover, things will all work out perfectly…but it never does because it can never…because to love is to suffer one way or the other lol

I have this feeling quite frequently. But I also know that I’ve repeated these patterns in my previous relationships and it has led to the same result. So for me I think it’s time to stop the madness in the context of this relationship.

@henryyyyyyyyyy

Can you say the same? What is your life like when she is not around? That may be the reason for feeling abandoned & neglected… it only makes sense to feel that way when one is in some kind of ‘trouble’ physically or emotionally.

I’d never considered this. But yes, my partner has a very easy/fun manner with pretty much everyone. She enjoys her interactions with everyone. I cannot say the same. For me she is the special “one”, with whom my most enjoyable interactions happen. It’s not that I am living a miserable life, but it’s definitely not balanced when compared to my time with her. That makes a lot of sense…

[jesus.carlos]

Thanks for this post Josef. Has been a light in this days. I was also strongly kicked and deluded by Love. Still trying to differentiate the good (and bad) from the innocuous. Is not always easy or clear. But the stone is set, there is where I want to stand on my own feet and work towards actual caring and intimacy.

[MattWG23]

I’ve been blinded by the concept of love; but i do see that love has never delivered on its expectations. And has caused more pain than peace. So I am left wondering, if not love, then what? What is it that is left over after self is seen to be non existant?

[Andrew]

We are all, to various degrees, wondering exactly that.

[jamesjjoo]

In a pce one can see that w/o love there is the perfection of the actual world.

[scout]

what was your experience of the feeling “love” like?

[Kub933]

I really like Richards description that love offers the promise of eternity, if I feel the flavour of love it is that promise of eternity which is at core. And for an ailing self that is the ultimate ‘fix’.

[MattWG23]

@Kub933

if I feel the flavour of love it is that promise of eternity which is at core. And for an ailing self that is the ultimate ‘fix’.

Thinking about this, it seems you have hit the nail on the head. Honestly, yes, that’s the promise I feel too: this love will make you live forever! For me it was learned in Sunday school… For god so loved the word…

Im slowly coming to accept that love, as thought and felt, might? not even exist.

[Josef]

Ah, this topic again. I feel like I’ve become disenchanted from love and yet it still has a hold over me. Recently I’ve been trying the actual intimacy approach again. Intimacy with every thing and every body. Intimacy that is outgoing from me rather than requested from someone. Intimacy that results from just feeling good about life. It’s not like love in that it’s not sticky. Love always seems to have an undercurrent of sorrow.

[milito.paz]

Big time. Josef, how would you say you go about being “intimate with every thing and every body”. What does it look like in action? How does it differ from your normal way of being?

[Josef]

When I feel good, I am naturally curious and interested in people. Interested in things. Interested in my life. The intimacy isn’t anything I’m conjuring up, it’s just a result of being engaged. I feel like the normal way of being is just dissociated and trudging through life, trying to survive. As for how to go about it…I’m still trying to figure out how to do it consistently. For the past few days I’d been going through a bit of a depressive spell, feeling like the depressive feelings were happening to me and I had to get rid of them. What has worked often for me is to fully BE the feeling, 100%. I tried this yesterday, and once I was BEING the feeling, I realized that I am “choosing” (quotes because the decision is kind of subconscious) to feel depressed, and why should I feel depressed when I can feel good instead? Being depressed sucks ass. Things are not that bad, I can just feel good instead! So I’ve “chosen” to feel good (quotes because the choosing happens immediately after you see this fact, it’s not really you doing the choosing). And with that, I’ve been feeling good for a day.

[milito.paz]

Thanks for that. Pretty much exactly what I do too and it works. I would always call it diving right smack into it. You feel the emotion so intensely that it reaches a peak then starts to slowly loosen its hold on you. It’s fantastic.

[jesus.carlos]

Appreciating and enjoying this moment seems like an impossible task, when you are in the grip of falling or being in love.

What I have found is that time and time again I must calm the passions by observing them, without doing anything in particular, observing the anxiety associated with passionate fever. also recognizing that nothing is in my hands (for example, I can’t do anything except try to manipulate the emotions of other human beings, something that I don’t really want, but it is caused by the dissatisfaction with the life that I experience and believe I can resolve. through love) except choosing how to live this moment (a decision that is not only rational, but mainly emotional, and that takes “time”, i mean a process, to develop).

It is interesting to go through the experience of love/falling in love, I see more clearly than ever everything that is at stake in the identity play. I must specify that at this moment I do not feel my desire reciprocated, which causes me many feelings of frustration, sadness, despair.

What is working in a progresive way? Recover the intention to enjoy my life regardless of what she does. And then move on from the intention to concrete actions that increase that enjoyment (walking, writing, talking with friends, multiple sensory experiences, etc.). And of course: recover the pure attempt to live a life free of violence and resentment, happy, harmonious and harmless.

Love is making me to be more and more interested in the AF method and goal.

[Josef]

I am finding the same things @jesus.carlos. Getting back onto the wide and wondrous path from being in love is a journey towards reclaiming one’s autonomy. A journey that disintegrates the promise of love. At some point, we surrendered our will and accepted the chains of love for the reward of validation and being special.